Recently I’ve found myself saying to people, “I’m not kinky.”
The last person I said that to replied:
You’re not real kinky??? Hahaha. You’re kidding me, right? You are soooooo hard-wired kinky you don’t know any different is all. Yes, one person’s kink is another person’s everyday thought.
This is a possibility.
I’d always maintained that there are two kinds of kinky people: intrinsic and artistic. Intrinsic kinksters are born, and kink is inextricable from their sexual identity, much like being gay. Artistic kinksters are made. Kink is a means of sexual expression, but not the means. I’m a cook/writer/ kinkster much in the way Bob Dylan is a composer/poet/musician/singer.
A means of expression. Not THE.
I don’t masturbate to BDSM porn (well, occasionally looking at stuff on Kink.com or reading Calico or Yin’s blog might inspire masturbation, but for the actual act, the Literotica sections I read while masturbating rarely have a BDSM component.)
I think I could be content in a vanilla relationship. Now, part of this is speculative and/or cheating: I have my play partners, after all, and assuming I have a kink itch, I could scratch it at the studio to my heart’s content. If I didn’t have this outlet, would I need to tie my boyfriend up during sex? I think any partner I have would need to be open minded and comfortable with me being sexually dominant … but Eros-slick rubber sheets-whipped ass-pissmouth-CBT-“go put your chastity cage on and fix me a turkey pot pie” KINKY? Eh, I dunno.
Or am I really just so hard-wired, I don’t even realize how kinky I am? What makes a person kinky? Do you consider yourself kinky? Why/why not?
I want to hear from ALL of you, btw. You can post anonymously if you want. Just let me hear from you.
The question is if you’d be content in a ‘nilla relationship if you didn’t have the outlet.
I’m afraid I’m hardwired. Though that doesn’t mean I won’t have a vanilla relationship.
I know a number of submissive guys in vanilla relationships because they loved the person more than they loved the kink, so they just put that part of themselves in the closet…so to speak.
@axe
You know the funny part is that everytime I read the line about ‘Eros-slick rubber sheets-whipped ass-pissmouth-CBT-“go put your chastity cage on and fix me a turkey pot pie” KINKY?’ I get a little tingle and kinda want that.
Shit.
In my previous relationships, all of which I’d say could be characterized as ‘vanilla,’ I was reasonably happy with our sex life. I was not monogamous in any of them, fwiw, but I never felt like I was denying any part of my self either. Then again, I didn’t know what a spreader bar was then. Or that I could wrap a man in a leather bag and hood, gag, and fuck him.
Though I did often have fantasies of covering my partner with one of those Jewish conjugal sheets? The one with the hole at the crotch? And just getting on top and fucking him that way, with his whole body covered by the sheet.
Shit.
Isn’t the restraint of mind far stronger than any physical restraint? I believe that’s the delicious part. It’s not about being locked. I’m quite handy, thank you, and if I were feeling that motivated (and not immobilized or stuck to a toilet seat), I’m sure I could unlock myself.
No, the idea of being in mental bondage, the kind where less is more, the perineum pierced with a silver ring and holding a tag that looks all too much like a numbered “Return to Tiffany’s” tag to ever feel quite in complete control again… that seems much more beautiful than having to clean rubber or eat turkey for the hundredth time.
It’s turtles all the way down in the end, anyway.
Troy – You got me at “Turkey pot pie”.
We haven’t met (but I know some of your friends). From what I’ve read and heard, I think “kinky” and Troy go together.
Miss Orleans,
Sometimes I think you know me better than I know myself – so you might disagree here, but for me it seems to be intrinsic. From my earliest days of maturation I recall visions and fantasies driven by pain and dominance. Even a few woeful fledgling attempts at self-dominance. Tough being the Top and bottom all at the same time! These were suppressed throughout my teens and early 20’s.
In my mid-20’s they started to seep out in various parts of vanilla sex. The tide began to rise in my 30’s and 40’s. Now, in my 50’s, it seems as if the floodgates have broken wide open. Often – too often – there is at least one part of my brain that is locked on to kinky thoughts. Nonstop. Remember me telling you about that night meeting not all that long ago when something was said that broke my concentration and had me thinking about you instead! It’s been with me always. So, yeah, I’d say it’s intrinsic.
As for your real bent. You always keep us guessing. You might know more that you’re letting on. That way you always keep us on our toes. I would say that you’d never send some one off for a turkey pot pie. At least not a frozen one! But geez, you read while masturbating. I can’t keep my eyes open to watch some good porn. You never cease to amaze and inspire.
Miss you.
Yours,
Whizzer
interesting link about Jewish conjugal sheets: http://www.snopes.com/religion/sheet.asp
I definitely would have to count myself as part of the intrinsic kinky group. That took me quite a while to find out (or maybe to admit to myself…)
re: anonymous and that link:
“The times for conjugal duty prescribed in the Torah are: for men of independence, every day; for laborers, twice a week; for ass-drivers, once a week; …”
hmm.
hmm.
Hey,
Great topic. I’m definitely (learning to spell I am 😉 ) hard hard wired. It’s actually a real issue in my life at this point as you may (or may not) gather. I’ve had three significant “vanilla” relationships and have not had a truly successful sex life … ever. Except with prodommes.
While I’ve enjoyed “vanilla” sex, I’ve always fantasized kinky to get me there.
Whether that means I’d be truly happy with a dominant or there’s some other Fear Factor deal going on is helping to insure a comfortable retirement for my shrink and probably driving a friend or two a little crazy.
I suppose not getting too uptight about it all is key … wouldn’t ‘cha say?
Nomenclature, comraderie, protocols, and analysis are great, but I’ve always been a little tweaked; couldn’t help it if I cared to.
It doesn’t take whips, or in fact, even bondage. I just love female intensity; I’m attuned to it. The right piercing stare changes my breathing pattern. A properly intentioned pinch or bite makes my pulse race. Overt aggression brings out primal passion; drives me absolutely crazy.
Love it.
LOVE. IT.
I’m a guy whose youth and good looks are long gone but who feels compelled… No, obssessed… to play as intensely as ever…
From early childhood, as long as I can remember I’ve intuitively known that Kink is in my genes. From the vantage points of introspection and retrospection, looking back on nearly a half-century of being almost permanently half-aroused (or just seconds from it, anyhow) I can damn near guarantee that Miss Orleans is not kinky… she’s super kinky (and I mean this as a supreme compliment), perhaps the kinkiest woman I’ve ever met.
The problem is that she is also intelligent, sensible, sensitive, well-adjusted and comfortable in her own skin, so much so that she’ll fool you if she wants to, and from time to time maybe even fools herself into thinking she could renounce this part of her psyche and just go vanilla. But no way guys.
I’ve read almost every word she’s ever posted and I’ve tasted her lash, so take it from me… I’ve lived with one vanilla woman for almost 40 years, and no matter how compatible our vanilla lives are, there’s no mistaking the real thing. If Troy wasn’t half my age, I’d proposition her to let me be her vanilla sub any time she gets a hankerin’ for that side of life.
She’s one of the stars!
Jack T
Hate to break it to you gal pal, but you are in the Kinkster Club, lifetime membership division. That you are “inspired” to masturbate by reading Yin’s stories or watching kink.com is pretty strong proof. But your own kinky exploits are too much to be just “working for the man.”
That said, I’m sure an occasional vanilla soiree is NOT that bad, just make sure you wash your hands when you are done.
It’s back to the old question I’ve had… Where’s the line when someone or some act stops being vanilla? I have to say that I think non-monogamous relationships is proof positive of the fact that you aren’t vanilla. You might not be a fetishist in the sense of kinky, but you are definitely outside the bounds of traditional sexuality.
And… well… you did just post a picture of a guy you had bound up and setup a tube feeding him what appears to be his own urine to his gag – and I might not be able to ID what’s vanilla, but I can definitely ID what’s kinky.
So, are women who wear shirts that say “biter” or “scratcher” inherently kinky?
If a woman tweaks a man’s nipple during sex? If she likes it in da butt? For him?
If she fantasizes about Jewish conjugal sheets? Made of leather?
Yah, ma’am… you don’t have to have the card in your purse for me to know you are a card carrying member of the kinksters club.
*wink*
BTW, that’s just a traditional wink, not a kinky one! 😉
Hi Troy, I am stuck some where in this ‘kink’ life that right now Iam not sure of anything?? do I have to make the turkey pot pie from scratch or can it be one of thoses frozen ones from the Acme?
The secret codicil to “The Rules” says “Don’t bring out the ball weights before the 20th date.”
I think you are either kidding yourself or kidding the rest of us. Seriously.
Now I do agree about the intrinsic vs. extrinsic flavors of kink. After years of watching people and myself, I think you’re onto an important distinction there.
But still the big question remains: Are those who know they are hard-wired to intrinsic kinky simply more self-aware or willing to admit it out loud? Maybe they are just more honest with themselves.
Do the extrinsic kinksters REALLY believe they could just drop it? For example, could you go plain vanilla after playing as much as you do or maybe vanilla with sprinkles—pro-play in the dungeon, vanilla at home? Isn’t that “intrinsic” under another name?
Maybe what I’m saying is that the “intrinsic vs. extrinsic” labels seem very cool and neat in an intellectual sense. But maybe in daily living, they don’t amount to REAL differences. By either definition, we end up in the same place—wanting (or perhaps NEEDING?) to play. Or do the intrinsics feel the NEED to play and the extrinsics merely WANT to play? Don’t they both end up playing?
With you, I note your stated desire to be the “dominant” person in the bedroom regardless. So which comes first for you: domination or kinky play? Is what you take from playing mostly a psychological thrill for you? I find that hard to believe since you are at least as much of a gearhead as me. (That was a compliment, BTW!) You are so athletic and physical in your play that the psychological benefits of playing can’t be everything to you.
I read your blog regularly and like it a lot. It reminds me of the wonderful hours I spent with you. So, I saw your question today about intrinsic vs. artistic kinksters. I have no doubts that I am in the intrinsic category: submission is a very well-integrated part of me; life would probably be much easier if I could resist my desire to bend to the will of a woman … but I cannot. And don’t get me wrong. I like who and what I am.
@midgetsex
Well, ultimately, “There is no spoon” and all that, yes. I like getting there. For sure.
The Tiffany perineum tag is meltingly hot to me. Assuming I ever get to that place with someone (and, honestly, I dunno. I don’t esp. believe in marriage so it’d be a little hypocritical of me to tag/collar someone, no?) … but if it ever was something that felt like the right thing to do. Yeah. That’s what I’d do.
And then I’d lick it. Every day.
@anon turkeypotpie
It appears you’re not alone in thinking so. Sigh.
@anon conjugal sheets
I don’t know why I’m resistant to identifying as kinky. Maybe because all my life I’ve never really been an easy fit for labels. “Too much of this or not enough of that” syndrome. Like if I start calling myself “kinky” then the Kinky Committee Membership Monitors are gonna call me out as an impostor.
@anon Jack T
You know, when you sign your name, you’re not all that anonymous anymore. 🙂
While I’m a little older than “half your age” (unless you’re 74+ … and, if so, daaaaamn, you look good, señor!), I appreciate the vote of confidence for me in the “(super) kinky” corner.
TO ALL OF Y’ALL …
It’s really interesting to me how many of you are aligning with the “intrinsic”/”in my genes”/”hardwired” team. I can’t help but wonder if — assuming most of you have played with me — that’s it’s a self-selecting, “Game Recognize Game” kind of thing. In other words, because you’re hardwired, you know hardwired when you meet her.
Shit. 😉
@Whizzer
So, one of the hallmarks of “intrinsic” is that you think about kink constantly? Hmm.
See, I don’t look back at my formative years and recall any explicitly kinky moments — certainly not solo explorations. Is every precocious moment actually ‘kinky’? When I was on top with my boyfriends, was I being ‘dominant’ or just trying something different? Doesn’t there need to be gear for it to count? Guess it’s all a matter of how one chooses to define such things, eh?
When you say you “suppressed” your urges in your 20s … what does that mean? Did you just not give yourself to … what? look at magazines? think about women in leather? Did you just always have missionary sex? I have no idea what ‘vanilla’ looks like, I guess.
@advochasty
What constitutes a “truly successful” sex life? Doesn’t everyone find themselves fantasizing about a sexual scenario other than the one they’re actually in at some point or another during sex? Whether it’s George/Angelina/Postal Carrier going down on you or “making love on a real train” or “A buttplug right about now would make this PERFECT!” or whatever.
And is it merely that you need a dominant woman? Or that you want the rubber sheets, cage, and pot pie of kink, too?
Ahem…cough, cough…you, hard wired kinky??? so anyway…
Yes, I’m hard-wired, my only complaint is that there are very few women who can dominate me beyond the “first dance”. To a degree, it’s that I have impossible standards for “her” to measure up to, at least as far as a full-time relationship goes. But generally, it seems pretty simple to me….
Be smart, beautiful, confident, sexy, fit, strong, KINKY, a woman, tell me what you want from me, tell me you appreciate it and tease the hell out of me. Oh, putting your foot atop mine helps too.
“text that’s been cut and pasted to an email to you”
I like what you write back to advochasty… to answer that question myself, if you’re dominant in accordance with my surrender terms stated above, then the rest is totally up to you…don’t really care whether it’s rubber, religous or horse-hair, get your damn blanket out and let me be like a boy on the playground that can’t resist being pushed to the ground by the girl he has a crush on.
So yeah, those that read your blog seem to think you are and I do too. But you already knew that too. Just one day I’m going to put my finger on why you seem unique in this collection of KINKstresses.
Thanks for posting!
@lc
I really miss you.
@LMPest
Well, no, I’m not ‘working for the man,’ that’s clear. I do genuinely love playing. And I don’t mean to be coy with this post. It’s really just a thing, like, I wonder if I have enough kink juice to sustain a romantic personal relationship with a kinky person.
Ooops. My insecurities are showing! grabs a towel
@lee
I used to really love the Swanson’s frozen chicken/turkey pot pies. Then Marie Callender(?) used to make an all white meat version with a great crust that I liked even better. Now I’m not so sure I could stomach a frozen one. Maybe a homemade from scratch one.
Troy,
You really stirred up the pot with that provocative blog.
Seriously, you, vanilla? Riiiight!!!
I’m not 74 yet, another 13 years to go, but I think that afternoon we calculated that for the balance of this year you were going to be half my age plus seven which is a magical formula at any age.
Thanks for helping me stay young, although another trip to the fountain of youth is long overdue.
JT
Miss Orleans,
My, my you have certainly hit upon a topic that resonates with many of us. Of course, you also wrote that you wanted to hear from “ALL” of us. So the replies are coming in fast and furious.
Your questions generate thought and research. Sort of like a homework assignment. Damn, never had assignments like this back in the day. Of course, never had a teacher that looked like you for that matter. Shit.
I think you begin to drill down to the core – to coin a phrase – as you query, “What IS kinky?”. An individuals answer to that will drive a lot of their response. Here are a few definitions that my research disclosed:
1. In everyday usage, describes abnormal sexual cravings or activities; Any sexual practice beyond conventional heterosexual intercourse
2. Sexual activity that is somehow non-traditional or exotic. See also BDSM.
3. Foot-sucking, rubber wearing, pee on me, fruit-fuckin’, candlewax drippin’, long fingernail scrapin’, tossed salad eatin’,multiple partner havin’, she-male, oil-drenched, chocolate sauce, whipped cream covered,vibrator usin’,dress-up,banned in 30 states type of sex.
4. not just whipped cream and cherries, although food fetishists will disagree! red bras have almost no part to play, unless it’s ordered that you wear one. anything that goes against the norm of sex – so oral, anal, masturbation and titwanks aren’t kinky.
think handcuffs, blindfolds, rope, leather, chains, spreader bars and anything that would shock the vicar and go from there, right on up to forced feminisation, scat (shit play), needles and knives.
5. last night i was blindfolded, tied to a st andrews cross and flogged. now THAT is kinky.
6. Slang for sexual activity that is considered to be outside the norm.
7. Kink is a term used to refer to a broad range of sexual practices (sometimes referred to as “kinky”) such as spanking, bondage, domination and submission, sadomasochism (BDSM). Kink sexual practices transgress what are considered “normal” sexual boundaries as a means of heightening the intimacy between sexual partners. (It is therefore distinguished from sexual fetishism, in which sexual desires are displaced from the intimate partner to an inanimate object). Because of its relation to “normal” sexual boundaries, which themselves vary by time and place, the definition of what is and is not kink varies widely as well. They are sometimes considered to be perverts by “outsiders”.
So you get the point. Some specifically reference gear or BDSM. Some just that which isn’t normal – which seems to beg the question. It seems pretty broad and very much in the eye of the beholder. Or perhaps in the hand of the flogger and flogee. Plus, one’s definition can change over time. Awhile back I would have agreed that there needs to be “gear for it to count.” Hot leather dress or corset. Stiletto heels. Today, it can be a simple cotton dress; bicycle gear, with pink crocs, bobbypinned hair, no makeup and big eyeglasses or even no clothes at all (of course, we know that’s something you DON’T do). Rope or chains for bondage. But today you can put me in inescapable bondage with a word, phrase, look, wink or nod.
In my 20’s I suppressed those thoughts of leather clad dommes with whips and chains, but enjoyed plenty of what definition 4 says is not kinky. Today those same acts can become very kinky when engaged in with someone who has taken control of my mind and body with just a word or a look.
To me it is then not so much the act but rather the mind set that makes something kinky. Although hot wax and needles do add a certain dimension.
So to paraphrase a famous U.S. Supreme Court quote: Kinky is hard to define, but I sure do know it when I see it!
Yours,
Whizzer
I’m not sure I heard you right…You were not monogomous during any of your vanilla relationships? Is this including or excluding work sessions in the studio? Fuck! I just want to meet you, because I need some answers.
So if the definition of kink is a means of sexual expression. Doesn’t that mean that anyone can be kinky, not just when rubber sheet, piss in the mouth, etc. is involved? Shouldn’t that mean making out with the right intent and thought behind it can be incredibly kinky.
Regards to whether you are kinky. If you want to use Bob Dylan as a comparison his career is based on him being artistic, you have a career that allows you to be kinky (being sexually expressive). I am sure at times Mr. Dylan went through the motions and my guess is that job at times is not well very sexual (I would deny this just in case anyone asks for their money back :)). However, if you enjoy your work and you excel at it then you are being kinky just as Mr. Dylan is being artistic. As for the rest of us mere mortals just there are times we are artistic in our lives there are times we are kinky. It may never be to the level of art or kink but isn’t that subjective to the person who is judging it.
Success!!! The funny word has returned!!
First, gotta say I dig Grandad’s bow tie!! Yah, he got game. I wants me some Red Lobster cheddar biscuits.
Here’s my responding post … the one currently burdening your inbox ‘cos I had no patience with the word verification thingamajiggy.
What is true success in anything? My idea of a “truly successful” sex life is one that is not a major factor for relationship failure or deep on-going problems. People say I’m easy …
I agree, everybody is fantasizing about a sex scene other than the one they are doing at some point when they’re doin’ it. Whether it’s torso harnesses of industrial chains, corseted necks or “Hi … My Name is advochasty and I’ll bottom for three weeks of on-my-honor chastity and standard tunes by Blossom Dearie, Chaka Khan and Betty Carter …”
BTW … I’m soooo honored you put the “making love on a real train” thing all up in your blog.
I think I need a dominant woman … I think it’s hard wired. That’s the “intrinsic” part. The pot pie of kink is the “artistic” part. It’s what our energy creates together. Leastwise … that’s my story tonight and I’m stickin’ to it!
What an incredible posting!!
Hiya Troy
STS here. As you know I’m a regular reader of the blog but I’m more of an observer than a participant but I thought I’d pitch in here after reading your own heart felt words and indeed the respondee’s own views.
You ask “What makes someone kinky?”
It’s a legitimate and interesting question, one that we have all asked at some time or another? Surely the fact that its been asked by so many, so many times, is an indicator that the answer (if there is one) is in that volume of questioning?
Let me elaborate. If I recall correctly, until relatively recently (in human history terms) a blowjob was regarded as ‘perversion’. It certainly was in Victorian times, in fact insisting on one was grounds for divorce as ‘aberrant behaviour. This is despite the fact that ancient art reveals that this delightful practice has been going on (and enjoyed) since the dawn of man (or woman) for that matter. Now its mainstream. Its out in the open. Everyone (pretty much) indulges and no one bats an eyelid when it’s discussed.
In Victorian England it was most certainly a kinky practice.
Anal sex is, I believe, still outlawed in several states of the US. Whilst its not exactly mainstream its certainly a regarded as a shocker by some but, really, if one broaches this subject with ones partner in today’s climate (especially with someone under forty) the reaction would be “Err no thanks” or “Yeah I’ll try it” as opposed to histrionics and demands for an immediate divorce.
A kinky practice? Not everyone’s cup of tea for sure but, today, hardly ‘kinky’, simply ‘a bit experimental the first time out
.
Being gay? Well, as we all know, definitely a no-no socially until the late sixties but now no one raises an eyebrow when someone ‘comes out’. Bi-sexuality, especially amongst women, seems to be almost de rigour if the media (and indeed my own experiences) are anything to go by. Kinky? I think not…….but go back thirty years?
So, having established that all of the above practices would have put one in the ‘kinky camp’ until relatively recently and yet today they are almost ‘mainstream’. Something unimaginable until recently. They are mainstream because so very many people practice them so they cease to be regarded as kinky.
Now, lets take spanking. Google it (as I’m sure we all have) and 35 million pages come up. 35 million! Now is this a ‘deviant practice’ enjoyed by a perverse few or a widely held interest? I think the latter. And yet spanking is regarded as kinky. Why, because its delicious pleasures are fraught with embarrassment and shame of its enjoyment as I’m sure the other actives I detailed above were at some time.
How many pro domes are working in NYC at this moment in time? Hundreds. One has to assume that they are all at least making some kind of living. There are over 200 currently listed on Max and I’m sure there are more than that. This is not some eclectic ‘out there’ service industry. This is a true ‘business’ as there are so many men prepared to seek out what it is that they truly desire. And men are not the only ones. I know from my own experience that there are as many ‘kinky’ women out there as kinky men.
So BDSM, whether it be an embarrassed gentle experimental ‘bottom spanking’ between a coy couple thinking that they are ‘living on the edge’ or some sub enduring the full blown “dominatrix beat down scenario’ they are both extensions of the same thing. An expression of ones sexuality and in some cases a celebration of that sexuality.
I’ve been verbose but I’m trying to make the point that maybe, in fifty or one hundred years time the term ‘kinky’ will be an irrelevance and perhaps the wonderful question that you’ve (and we’ve all) proffered will be unnecessary. We’ll all accept that sexuality is a broad church. IE if I try to pick up a girl today and she tells me “Thanks but no thanks, I’m gay”, my reaction today would be “Fine, thanks for telling me, have a nice life”, whereas thirty years ago my reaction would have probably been very different.
Sexuality is as wide and diverse as the human race itself and whether you like your ear being nibbled and having needles stuck through it doesn’t make you ‘kinky’ or ‘different’, you’re (or we) are simply celebrating the delightful fact that we are all unique individuals with individual tastes. We’re celebrating our own unique sexuality.
You know, I don’t think ‘kinky’ exists. I just think that the human race is (hopefully) evolving to a stage where we can all eventually state our sexual needs, fantasies and desires and not be judged by the fearful for them. Everyone has eclectic desires. The people on this blog (and many others) are just brave enough to be honest about themselves and their sexual desires. T’was the same with gays, anal sex enthusiast’s and blowjob fanatics in the past.
You’re not kinky Troy, you’re just prepared to be honest about your desires and what you enjoy. You’re part of the human race. Myself and the posters here and your clients are with you and feel the same way…..eventually the rest of the human race will get up to speed and start being honest. Its never easy being a pioneer though is it?
@aarkey
Well they weren’t poly or even “open” relationships. Just … well, I think of it as just evolved and mature. Nontraditional only as far as “traditional monogamy” is kinda unrealistic. Not kinky so much as practical.
So the consensus is: I’m kinky. I do kinky things so therefore I am. Lotta guys though think kinky but never actually do it. Maybe it’s not so much about what’s on the T-shirt as it is how people think of themselves/their actions.
@t
What do you need answers for? There’s not much more to say than what I told Aarkey above and it’s not your business to ask anyway.
@anon ‘kidding yourself’
Like you, a shrink would say that one can set up all the dichotomies one wants but in the end everyone’s in the same pool anyway. As this conversation makes clear, there’s not a meaningful distinction between “artistic” and “intrinsic” kinky.
I think the dominant part comes first for me in that it’s an inherent personality trait. I can put away the gear. I can fuck missionary or even doggie. I can take a helluva beating when I ask for it. But I’m not submissive. I can be polite. Deferential, even. But not submissive.
While the gear and the physical and logistical challenges play presents certainly get my attention, it’s the psychological elements, I think, that keep it and keep me here. Sorta like when you’re out on a vanilla date and you know you’re gonna kiss, it’s just a matter of how you’re gonna get there and when? That’s the juicy part to me. The kiss itself … it’s supernice (one hopes) and all, but the thrill is that space of hours or seconds between when you know it’s going to happen and it does. Same with play. Getting someone up in a spring suspension, say, is supernice, but for me the Woohoo! is correctly identifying whose mind will get blown if I do that scene with him. It’s finding the button. Does that make sense?
@anon, the no doubt intrinsic one
One of the things I’m loving about the replies on this thread is how many of you DO embrace this aspect of yourselves. I’ve always said how important to me it is for the people I play with to be comfortable with their kink and it just makes me really, really happy to see that it’s true. I wouldn’t change ya either, babe.
@peter k.
That’s an interesting kind of dynamic you describe. We have a similar approach to this, you realize: We both have a “You have to earn/deserve me” attitude. As a pro, by definition, I can kinda play with just about anyone (unlike Axe, I don’t have to be physically attracted to someone to have a great scene). Yet if someone wants to stay my client, he’s gotta put in the work.
@whizzer
I like definition 7.
And I totally agree it’s about the mindset. “Intention,” if you will. For example, I believe there is such a thing as a “dominant handjob.” (Though that rose, by any name, I’m sure smells just as sweet.)
@anon who wrote Shouldn’t that mean making out with the right intent and thought behind it can be incredibly kinky.
Yes. That gets my vote, at least.
As I said in the OP, kink is a part of my artistic expression. I’ve realized of late that of all the things I’ve done professionally that have been gratifying (cooking, writing, domination), the one thing they have in common is they all provide a means for me to make someone say, “Wow!”
@advochasty
Where I grew up, if a boy took you to Red Lobster, you knew he was serious about you. Not just anyone is worthy of those cheddar biscuits.
By your definition of “truly successful sex life” I think about 70% of long term relationships fail. I don’t know of a single couple (and I’ve been to 22 weddings) who’ve been together for more than five years with a sex life that fits your definition. I’m not even counting my clients, who by and large weight the negative, in that reckoning.
I wonder how many men who’ve replied thus far can make the distinction that they need a dominant woman “more” than they need the kinky stuff.
Glad you’ve enjoyed the post. I have too. LOTS!
@anon STS
I like your attitude, cowboy!
What you’ve said here is essentially what I’ve been feeling and occasionally saying from the beginning. It’s “kinky” cause that’s what someone else calls it. I just call it fun. Sexy. Interesting. Inspiring. Exploratory. Experimental. Precocious. Loving. Wild.
There are a lot of people in the BDSM community who are very invested in their sex being “outside” or identifying as “perverted.” They love the subversiveness and underground of it all. I find I don’t need to feel I’m being taboo to enjoy this stuff. Quite the opposite, in fact.
BTW, w/r/t your comments re: spanking and Google. There’s a Federal obscenity trial that recently concluded in Florida in which the defense suggested that “community standards” weren’t quite as narrow as the law might think based on Google data that showed “orgy” was a more popular search term than “apple pie.” While the pornographer was found guilty, I do think this was a pioneer move, too.
Troy,
I remember briefly touching on this subject when we met. You strike me as someone who will defy nearly any box that anyone tries to put you into so it makes sense to me that being labeled a “kinky person” would not make sense to you.
To me, it simply means that I not only enjoy BDSM but that I seek and desire creative and intense means of communication (including body communication) with my loved ones. I relate to your definition of “artistically kinky” a lot these days.
-Tara
P.S.
As usual, thank you for the time and energy you put into your blog. I enjoy it!
Miss Orleans
Congratulations for latching on to what has been a fascinating discussion. I thought you might like that 7th definition. I kinda liked it myself – A LOT!
I’ve found the positions of those who say that you must be intrinsically kinky to be most interesting. I think they overlook your original comments that you can have the same enjoyment even if it’s achieved through the artistic approach. Or even if it’s not called kink. There is certainly no doubting your love of what you do. The Kinkstress part of what you do is your job. You may love it and it may well be much more that just a job, but still whatever our job, it is something that we all need to step away from once and awhile. So why not you as well. Of course, reading erotic literature while you masturbate is not exactly mainstream middle America.
Speaking for all of us, I think, just let me say that whatever the answer to your question of intrinsic vs. extrinsic turns out to be, we all just hope that you’ll keep doing what you’re doing for a long time to come.
Yours,
Whizzer
Mmmmm … to be worthy of some cheddar buscuits!
So based on your stats, I should just chill, stop putting my shrink’s kid through college and enjoy some home cooked pot pie! All this public angsting for naught…
I’m truly confident that it is the woman and the personality fit that matters most. I like some gear and a nice room but I’d trade all the “stuff” for a smart, funny, kick-my-ass dominant who laughed at my lame jokes.
I really liked the other guys posts on the blur between “kink” and “vanilla” to the point that labels are irrelevant and confining. Not only do I love this post but it sort of reoriented my take on “this thing of ours”. Like Hyman Roth said to Michael … “This is the life we have chosen.” Or have we really?
Oh…I guess that’s the post… Jeez, keep up advo.
Semantics. I think if your libido is always amped up, you’re kinky. Of course different individuals have different leanings, but specific turn-ons are passing. That’s why you want a creative partner or dominatrix, the same routine again and again, however hot the first time, will eventually lose it’s luster.
Although people tend to fall into categories, there are as many fetishes as there are humans, and it’s natural to think of someone else’s as being weird. Yours are weird too! Again, the kinky part is your level of obsession.
Naturally everyone on here will prefer to think of themselves as hardwired, it’s not an especially useful term. The formative influences are poorly understood, and a lifetime is enough time to discover many new pleasures that you didn’t think of when you were a teenager.
I think of myself as kinky because a lot of things turn me on all the time. “Regular” sex is fabulous! I want it every day, but I want to explore the other things as well, and I’m confident that the future will reveal new treats that will make me absolutely sizzle.
It’s not a classification, it’s just a convenient word.
Hello Troy, another post from a reader who doesn’t usually comment. We had a couple sessions a few years back. I am kinky to the core. As such, I can tell whether the Domme is just going through the motions to pick up a few bucks or truly deeply kinky. There is absolutely no doubt whatsoever in my mind that the kink runs deep inside you. Those sessions were so profound that no person not completely totally into bdsm could have performed them.
I think you are experiencing one of those lonely moments that we ( the kinksters) all do. Its tough enough to find a companion that truly fits. Add in the requirement that Mr. Perfect must be into bdsm is almost too much to ask. Read attimesrestless.blogspot.com for a similar prespective by a sub who struggles with whether to go vanilla. Unfortunately, just about everyone who “goes vanilla” ends up regretting it.
Its a moment we all face in the lonely-hearts bdsm club.
@Tara
Glad you’re enjoying my blog! The artistic/intrinsic hypothesis is something I’ve been batting around for a while. I think, however, it may be time for me to just admit I’m kinky no matter how ya slice it. 🙂
@whizzer
Reading erotica while masturbating isn’t mainstream? Really? Why does Penthouse Variations exist then?
You may be right, however, about people not realizing that there I’ve got more than one way to get a man, or myself, to “Wow!” Still, whatever it is, it’s in me.
@extranormal
I agree “kinky” is pretty much just another label, but I don’t particularly associate obsessiveness or frequency with kink. Can’t even say I’d go so far as to call anyone’s kinks “weird” myself. My tact is usually to try to understand why first.
However, I DO very much like the idea of you sizzling and wonder what I might introduce to you next to make that happen.
@b4iwuz7
I’m intrigued. Enough to invite you to identify yourself privately. Always like running into former clients.
I don’t know if I’m particularly lonely as much as just curious to see what kind of men I’m attracted to as I start to dip my toes into trying to date again. Given how some of y’all talk about how you think about and desire kink All. The. Time., I worry a little that were I to date a kinkster I might not be able to keep up with him.
But that’s all cart FAR before the horse. I’m sure when push comes to handcuffs and a knee to the balls, I’ll do just fine. 🙂
My opinion: one of the occupational hazards of being a dominatrix is the almost impossibility of having a meaningful long-term relationship with someone not into the kink. Most of the general public equates dominatrices with escorts or call girls, so that eliminates a big chunk of the vanilla gene pool. Then you’ve got the problem of keeping a male who knows that 8-10 times a week, you – an avowed kinkster – are alone with a variety of different aroused naked men doing your kink. Lastly, most of us become what we do for a living. Spend 8-10 hours a day humilating men, it ain’t easy to turn the bitch switch off and be the adoring wife at home. If your significant other is not a true sub, that gets old real fast.
These of course, are general comments and surely don’t apply to you.
I surf Craigslist for amusement and breaks from my online work. Sometimes I spend more time than I should, to be honest. I have a new Mac and I have found that I can see the key words in recent CL searches. I wonder if collectively, they might be an indicator of my being kinky?
In no paritcular order:
Keywords for searching the Erotic Section:
Model
Tease
Prolonged
Prostate
Submissive
Dominant
Voyeur
Exhibitionist
Masturbation
CFNM
Clit
Bootie
Booty
Squirt
Spank
Bondage
Rope
T4M
Tie
handcuffs
photographer
Voyeur
forced
It’s not like I act on any or all of it. It’s not like I am totally vicarious either because I do get out, about, and around.
Has far as masturbation goes, I rarely do a quickie. I wait for a prolonged period of alone time and I make a production of it. Often, I simply imagine. Other times I will read and other times I will look at a DVD or three. Mental and visual stimulation can cover a very wide range. Lots of BDSM stuff and lots of more conventional stuff and lots of non-BDSM unconventional stuff.
Maybe kinky applies to me. I don’t think or expect one partner to be interested in or able participate in such a wide and ever expanding range of things.
NYC sub…
I read your comments with interest. I think you’re quite right about it being tough to find and thrive in a “meaningful, long-term relationship” with someone not kinky, or for that matter, someone who is kinky! Jealousy; the Mistress-wife not wanting to play when she gets home and all that jazz!!! LOL.
On the other side of the coin and speaking from my own experience, it’s also very difficult for a guy who has enjoyed the professional company of a Domme to have a fulfilling relationship with a significant other, unless there’s a lot not being disclosed (to the wife/partner).
Try telling your spouse that it’s all quite “spiritual” and not at all sexual when the domme strips off my clothes, pushes me to the ground, binds me, pisses all over me and IF I’m good, lets me worship her feet! In softer words, I’ve tried to plead this case before and all I hear is “I’m not good with sharing you”, so no.
While I don’t discount the possibility of being in a monogomous relationship that is fulfilling, it sure doesn’t seem practical for me.
ps. While I’ve proposed countless times to Miss Orleans (all politely declined), I can tell you there are some “nuts” out there that’d be just fine with a partner who is a Domme– as long as she was willing to bring home her briefcase and keep working at the end of the day. 😉
Good point peter k., that is what keeps pro dommes in business. Hubby gets a taste of being topped, you can’t tell the wife so you end up going back again and again and paying for it.
@nyc sub
While I don’t think “turning the bitch switch off” is much of an issue, I’ve definitely been wondering if, given my occupation, and high expectations if I may, in fact, be undateable.
It’s possible.
@garrett
I think you’re kinky like I like to think I’m kinky. More like open-minded pleasure seeker.
As for non-quickie masturbation. Giggle. I like the idea of a date with yourself. Complete with seduction. Though maybe that’s not what you’re talking about.
@PK and NYCsub
There are some prodommes who maintain that you can either be in a romantic personal relationship or you can have strong professional relationships. I know when I’m really on and poppin with my clients, I don’t have much of myself left to give to a personal relationship and … I also know when I’ve been flushed with crushy, lovey feelings for a man, it makes it really hard to, well, get really hard for my clients.
Goes both ways, babe.
“….As for non-quickie masturbation. Giggle. I like the idea of a date with yourself. Complete with seduction. Though maybe that’s not what you’re talking about….”
That is absolutely to a capital T what I am talking about. I can devote hours to the prolonged ritual and it is definitely date-like. I will bathe, shave various body parts, groom exactly as for love making. I may get high. I might set out some stuff and play in front of a mirror as if for my lover as audience, cock rings, cock and ball bondage, clips of various kinds, perhaps a modest insertable of some sort. I will then recline on the cool, clean sheets, and take it from there. Since my first explorations of prolonged masturbation and self-edging, I have become, by necessity,a lube person. Gotta have plenty of lube for the long haul, as it were. My masturbation takes on a similar menu approach to my/our love making. Never, ever a rush. The slow and gradual buildup and then the prolonged ascension to ever and ever higher plateaus.
Sorry, I am making myself horny. If I smoked cigarettes, I might have one now. Instead, I think I will take a shower.
@garrett
You made me horny too. Or maybe it was the fact that I read your comment via my Blackberry while surrounded by a passel of scantily clad dominant women. The context as much as the content.
To me, the word “kinky” contains a necessary measure of “minority”, or “different”, or, at the very least, “unusual”.
Yet you are the person to whom her sexual proclivities/activities come most naturally, so effortessly, so much as part of your everyday life that I cannot see you as kinky.
Now talk about “perverse”….:-)))
Guilty, and kinky (as I once famously heard it called) as a cheap garden hose. But kinky isn’t all I thought it would be. For me kinky has been variously dangerous, elitist, (pity them poor vanilla folk who just don’t get it) a source of infinite wonder and, naturally, the Protestant cliché supplier of shame and guilt. Just when I’ve pegged myself as a definite ‘artistic’, and kink is just the embroidery of a healthy curiosity, I realize that it isn’t something I could shed or separate myself from. I have tried. Many times, but this addiction isn’t quitting — at least not without taking my last shred of self respect with it.
I told you this once, I think, that I had a brief affair with a mistress, (I’d be interested, incidentally, to learn if this is an occupational hazard – all that trust and intimacy, and occasional nakedness, can’t be a bad way to check out a potential partner). The thing that intrigued us both was to what extent our kinky selves would bleed into the normal stuff of relationships. We’d experiment: Could buying tube socks, for example, be transformed into a kinky activity? How about doing the dishes, going to Starbucks etc. What neither of us expected was that things flow naturally. From bondage to buying groceries there seemed a natural delineation between was ‘a session’ and what was just us being Mr. and Mrs. Normal. We didn’t force it, we didn’t try. It just happened. Of course, sometimes we’d feel compelled to infuse some innocent activity with an underlying nasty game of our own, but mostly though we’d be content not to be ‘on’ all the time and occasionally forego the stilettos for the sweats. With the inspiration and outlet for your kinkiness so near at hand, the heart doesn’t have to beat so fast. It just beats deeper.
I’d say I’m an intrinsic kinkster, and yes kinky, because I know the difficulty of getting a vanilla g/f to get excited over the things that excite me.
That said, there is always room for artistic suggestion. Just tonight, circumstances forced me to consider the fun in being spontaneously mindfucked by an airline phone agent 🙂