Because I’m loathe to join Sugasm just to heighten my post count and I really do want to give y’all more stuff to read and respond to (I *LOVE* my commenters!!!!), I’ve decided to start reposting some of my more defining contributions to The Hang at Max Fisch for further reflection and discussion (esp. since there are quite a few of you who never set foot in the place … not that I blame you). If you’re familiar with my writing over there and there’s a particular post of mine that stands out for you, please send me a link so I can consider republishing it here.
Someone on Max had asked about why there didn’t seem to be many independent Dommes training newer Dommes these days. Initially I replied that that was exactly how I came up in the Pro scene, thanks to the time, generosity, and effort of several of the country’s well-respected and established professional Dominas. I continue to be influenced by many of them in my practice and still will still seek out their feedback and advice. While the OP seemed to believe that sort of thing no longer goes on, I’m pleased to say that I know several young Dommes who have found mentors and educators from senior members of our professional community. Some folks simply don’t need to advertise the fact.
A few posters took issue with the idea that up and coming Dommes needed to be trained by Indies in order to learn anything, that the larger BDSM community was more than capable of teaching them the necessary skills via various public workshops, retreats, and conferences.
This was my reply.
While I have attended a few lifestyle events (Black Rose, Shibaricon (2x)) and workshops (various DSF/TES programs, seminars at Purple Passion, Midori’s rope dojo) and I’ve also done some private consultations with scene pros such as Delano, Scott Smith, Max of Seattle, and others, what I learned there was practically a different universe than what I gained from my apprenticeship and mentoring relationships with active, independent NYC Dommes.
When Domina M started Luxuria, one of the smartest things she did, in my opinion, was to bring in some of the city’s most successful and reputable professional female Dominas with proven skills and experience to teach her apprentices. This did a couple of things:
First, we got to see how this stuff really worked in a pro scene, often practicing on active clients (not video hos or houseboys but men who actually pay for sessions with professional Mistresses on a regular basis.). Because I trained mostly on clients, I learned how to play with clients. Men who can’t take marks. Who don’t have ‘leather ass.’ Who aren’t young or bendy or just willing to endure anything cause they’re just so damn happy to have pretty women paying attention to them. I learned how to talk with, negotiate, and understand men who have professional relationships with ProDommes (as opposed to, say, house slaves and personals who have a very different connection to Mistresses). I learned to respect these men who seek our services: what their needs are, what’s important to them, what makes them come back. It was market research as much as it was skill development. I can’t thank those men enough for their invaluable feedback.
TES and Shibaricon are great and I’ve learned a lot in those workshops, but I also get super frustrated trying to translate how to do that tie or re-rig that predicament to work for a male bottom because easily 70% of the lifestyle event presenters are male Tops and/or like their demo subs with boobies, limber bodies, long hair and who can also take marks.
Those aren’t the people that support my business.
Having those experienced women train us also meant that they had somewhat of an interest in our success. I hope that it makes those women as proud for me to say that they mentored me as it makes me proud to be able to thank them for their support and everything they taught me.
On the other hand, I’ve taken at least three classes from Midori, including her weekend Dojo intensive: I don’t think she’ll be posting on any message boards or blogs, “Yeah, Troy *rocks*! Huzzah!” Midori’s also not ever going to make as much money for me as I’ve made for her raving about the Dojo. On the other hand, I share clients with pretty much all of the women who mentored me because we all refer our clients to each other. Domme referrals are a significant part of my business.
I am very happy to do what I can to support and mentor the women in this community who show a sincere interest in developing their business and their skills as a professional Mistress — just as the women who helped me did so generously and graciously. This is our community, our union even. We work really hard at an incredibly challenging and demanding job. The more we help each other, the more we ALL benefit.
I think the people who think of it as Dommes “training their competition” kinda miss the point. The competitive atmosphere that exists both within the Domme community and as imposed on it by clients is … well, useless, really. “She the best _____ in the scene today!” Really? What does that mean? For whom?
The “best” Domme is simply the one that’s best FOR YOU. Period. She might not be able to tie a shoelace, but if she makes your little sub heart go potato-potato and all your kinky fantasies come true, then she is gonna be The Best Domme as far as you’re concerned. As long as I’m managing my business correctly, I should never have to worry about “competition.” If my client finds someone else who fulfills his needs better: Mazel Tov! The clients who are right for me will find me when they’re the right client for me. When they stop being the right client for me, I’ll refer them to my colleagues who I think might be right for them.
Having been mentored by my fellow professional Dominas also means I learned a lot about the ins and outs of the business. Lifestyle players can teach me how to play lifestyle, scene educators can teach me about lots of different aspects of play, from how to negotiate a scene to skill sets to aftercare, but the best advice on how to be a ProDomme is going to come from other ProDommes in my market who are serving my client pool. They’re gonna teach me about when to watch a clock and when not to. When to negotiate my Tribute, how, and with whom. How to balance my income and expenses and asset management. How to take care of my taxes and savings. How to assess the cost of a scene, both emotionally/psychologically as well as financially. Some of them are even going to, by example, show me what NOT to do.
Fact is, I’ve got a pretty great business. I’ve 4 1/2 years as a ProDomme, 3 1/2 as an Independent. I have my own space, a mess o’ gear and high quality equipment, my finances are in order, I’m growing my savings, and I have zero debt. I may not be The. Best. Domme. Anywhere. Ever. but I’m here and I’m doin’ alright for myself. And that’s because not only did I have the desire to learn and succeed, but I had the support of many incredible, generous, talented professional Independent Dominas, including:
Ladies, I thank you.
There are more indies today than 10 years ago at least in NYC. As rising rents have closed down several of the longest-running houses, more dommes have gone indie. And then many chose to run their own businesses as indies, too. So more indies are available for training opportunities and mentoring. Whether they choose to do this is up to them but the greater numbes are there.
There is also the appeal to indie dommes as women owning their own businesses and training each other how to succeed on their own. That beats working for (The) Man anytime. 🙂
From what I’ve read on other blogs an hearing from a few of my friends, the Indy Dommes like yourself usually have more knowledge of what they’re doing.
Again, from what I’ve heard and read elsewhere, the big houses are more interested in volume than quality and they train accordingly.
Garbage in, garbage out.
Time for Mr. Monkey-Pest to play the devil’s advocate. Sure its nice what Domina M did for you, but was it really worth it for her? Her place closed down soon after. From a business point of view, an indie training an apprentice makes no sense. Face it, a little bit of know how, the right look, a web-site and a cell phone and she is open for business on her own keeping the $250-$300 an hour. There isn’t any sort of state license she needs to get to operate. I’m sure indies training assistants is for the “greater good”, but from a business point of view, it makes no sense whatsoever.
@marcj
Part of what attracted me to Luxuria was that I’d be trained by women in a woman owned facility. I like the sisterhood in this and it frustrates me so when some of the women in this business take a more competitive approach.
@axe
To actually have a business to speak of as an indie there has to be a certain level of competence. Usually indies charge more than house dommes too, so clients have slightly higher expectations, I think. Part of the mission behind Luxuria was to have a very elite space with very well-trained Mistresses. I think in such ventures though, size does matter. My impression is it’s hard for a small dungeon to be all that financially viable. But a lot of the women are flaky and you spend too long training them, you won’t have a chance to recoup your investment before they quit.
@LMPest
Well, she didn’t just do it for me. There were four Apprentices in all. But, more than that, she really did it for herself. It wasn’t a noble, altruistic act or anything: she wanted to increase her business revenue! Like a house, the mgmt took a percentage of the Apprentices’ tributes in exchange for providing the space, advertising, equipment, training, etc. So in theory, she would make money off every session we did. The better trained we were, the more we’d work and the more revenue we’d generate.
While it’s certainly true that I coulda woke up one day and said, “Hey, I wanna be a prodomme!” and launched myself in a couple of days with a website, Eros ad, etc. I certainly don’t think I’d have the business I do today had I not had the training and mentoring that I did.
Now, as for the business benefits of simply being a mentor … depends on the mentee. It’s not like I didn’t earn M any money, first of all. I think it’s fair to say Luxuria made more money from me than it spent on me. I’m pretty sure Domina M’s gotten a few sessions from guys who’ve seen me and figured they’d check out the putative source material. Plus, I regularly recommend and reference the women who took part in my development as a professional dominant so there’s some free credible advertising there. It’s not like it costs any real money to mentor someone, anyway.
Besides, what’s all this “lookin’ out for #1” attitude anyway?
Well Miss Troy, it IS a business you are running, you said so yourself. From a financial sense, it doesn’t make any sense. Thinking back, I’ve seen a number of times over the years independent Dommes announcing someone is working with them. The associate always seems to just fade away. Not everyone is cut out to be a sex worker. Plus, the stuff most businesses do with associates to maximize their revenues, like keep the associates away from the clients working on paperwork ( like engineers, accountants, and lawyers) or signing non-competition clauses ( like dentists, optometrists and physicians) doesn’t work for Dominatrices. Other than a sense of altruism, there isn’t much benefit to it.
@LMPest
Sigh.
Thank you for your opinion.
Out of curiosity: Do you actually session? Who have you played with professionally? How are you as or more qualified to determine what are sound business practices for a professional Domina than I?
LOL, this is exactly why I am so very valuable in the pro domme blogging community. The whole group ( except for yours truly) are either Dommes (who basically write about how great they are) or submissive men ( who nod their heads and agree with anything). What kind of discussions does that foster? Hey, without a foil like me, how can you show how smart you truly are? Business is business, whether you run a large international company company or work as a dominatrix. The same principles apply.
Hey, the whole Monkey-Pest experience isn’t bad. I gave a shout out to you to London’s most cerebral female submissive. Now she has list you as her favorite blog: http://pmsleaze.blogspot.com/2008_08_01_archive.html
Troy, first off- hi, this is Noel who came to visit last week with our lovely mutual pro friend from upstate of you.
Second, and rather more to the point- Thank You for this post. I’ve really strongly been considering going the pro route (c’mon, getting paid for something I absoultely adore is really an appealing idea, despite knowing the potential complications), but was discouraged a bit from the idea of seeking a pro mentor under the “who wants to train competition?” idea.
I’m actually quite curious if you have any suggestions in that department?